Time for a little holiday controversy
In the past couple of days, a new theme of discontent has been surfacing regarding the holiday season. Yesterday a friendly outspoken neighborhood republican said to me, 'Merry Christmas. You are Christian, right?' I said, 'no, I'm Jewish.' He said, 'What would you say if I told you, Merry Christmas?' On the tip of my tongue was, 'I hate Christmas' (but of course, I just mean the stress and materialism surrounding it, and the oppressive marketing that starts practically right after they take the Halloween items off the shelves!) but really I just wasn't sure what he was getting at. Then this morning I read this article.I turned around and asked my coworker, "Come on now, tell the truth. Are Christians really offended when someone says, 'Happy Holidays' to them? I mean are you really offended?
To which he replied, "Yes, I am offended. When the greeter at Wallmart is forced to say 'Happy Holidays' instead of what they want to say, which is 'Merry Christmas' and when I can't find one card at Hallmark that says 'Merry Christmas' because they all say 'Seasons Greetings'. Its just this politically correct' environment, and yes, I am offended."
So I asked him what's wrong with making sure that no one feels left out or like an outsider because they have a different religion then him. He answered, "Too bad, this is a Christian nation. WE are the majority. They are letting a minority voice control everything."
So, I said, "This is a melting pot of many races and religions. Are we also a white nation? Because whites are in the majority too."
He said "yes"
then it got ugly.
But anyway, once we cleaned the blood and teeth off the office floor, I decided I wanted to get some more opinions on the subject. Christians, are you really offended when someone at Wallmart says Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas?
People of other religions, are you offended or do you feel left out when someone/Wallmart says Merry Christmas to you?
I know I don't, I know that when someone says Merry Christmas to me, they are just trying to be polite and kind and send me good wishes, not offend me on purpose, so I just smile and say Merry Christmas to you. Of course, having grown up as a minority in a 'Christian majority' nation, perhaps I have just grown accustomed to being left out and feeling like an outsider... Well, its something to consider anyway, along with the wider issue of whether 'politically correct' means we are growing as a nation, or whether it is a bad word equivalent with 'pandering to every whining minority'. (I for one don't see what's wrong with trying to avoid hurting people's feelings or making them feel bad, simply by using inoffensive language)
Are people really upset about this issue??
posted by Evil Genius @ 11:33 AM
17 comments
17 Comments:
I do feel offended when people say "Merry Christmas". I generally figure they do it out of ignorance and not malice, but assuming that I am Christian is just very disrespectful. How arrogant is it to assume that everyone celebrates their holiday?
Your coworker is an asshole.
you get 10 bad points
woahhhhh Noam's riled up! haha i haven't seen that side before! awesome :)
i was raised a Christian, but of course i was also blessed to grow up in Columbia with so many different kinds of people and also to be able to celebrate with your family, so my "christian" perspective probably wouldnt be the norm.
i will say tho that i had a friend that forwarded me an email from a Christian Coalitioin type group saying that people shouldn't shop at stores like Target because they made decisions to not use the words Christmas in their advertising. Bill O'Reilly, the ever so unbiased (yeah right) Fox News guy said "There is an anti-Christian bias in this country, and it is more on display at Christmas season than any other time." The funniest part to me was that the nite before i got this i saw a target ad and thought that it had too much Christmas elements! I mean they use the color red all the time and also have xmas trees and other stuff so its not like they arent excluding or bashing Christmas... they just aren't specifically saying those words. its quite a stretch to say that is then anti-Christian. but then i am not suprised, that is the method of the far right. Jimmy Carter really talks about it well in his new book - about how the far right, and alot of republicans now, come from this religious view that isn't based on what Jesus said, but more on "divine interpretation". i.e. these folks have a direct relationship to God and know what the bible says becausee of it and because of that they have a moral superiority and if you don't agree then you are a hater and anti-Christian. i've experienced this in person! when i was in college trying to talk to some folks about homosexuality, i was told to my face that they would not talk to me because i was evil and they were good and if they even just talked to me, they would be building a bridge between good and evil. wat the heck!
anyways, i of course, am not offended by saying happy holidays and including people. i don't really get how that is anti-christian, but yes, some folks really do. maybe its just backlash. to me its not about being PC, its about having respect for people. if you have that then you'd respect people individually and not just assume that they were like you or should be like you. but, alas, we are a young nation with alot of history of exclusion and lots of work to do. but don't sweat it! i love hannukah! when's the party!? i cant wait for latkes! :)
Actually, Jon Stuart just yesterday did a hillarious bit on this issue. Click on the one called "Secular Central."
Sorry about my nastiness towards your friend, but I hate bigotry.
The Christmas decorations in New York City are beautiful. The one in the public library was so lovely I had to take pictures with my camera phone. I have no problem with Christmas and all that. But why are they unhappy with "Happy Holidays"? Only because they *want* to be exlusive. They want to send a message that anyone who's not Christian doesn't belong here, is an outsider, is less than the rest of us. That is nasty, and a dark direction for our country to take.
I am more offended by the sheer commericialism of Christmas (or the Holiday Season). I don't care one way or the other if someone says "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Holidays." Unless I know for sure someone is Christian, I try my best to say "Happy Holidays." I mean really, there are a lot of holidays in November/December/January.
Quite frankly, Christians who get a rise out of this petty issue are copping out. There are greater insults and issues to handle than what to say during the Holiday Season.
And I agree, your coworker seems like quite the gigantic turd.
Amen Noam! You are right in what you say, i was just surprised you called him out like that! haha
PS - I just saw a Target commercial that says Merry Christmas at the end of it! Stinkin stupid right wingers!
Ramadan Mubarek everyone! (a bit late, sorry!)
La ilaha ila Allah wa Muhammadun rasulullah!
O'Reilly is such a freakin knob. I don't know why he focuses on the "Merry Christmas" shit when he can do better things (and has) like focus his viewer's attention on judges who give shitty (short) sentences to child molesters who end up getting out and killing children. Maybe he is grumpy because no one at work that will rub that loofah on his cock.
If you are offended by the word "Christmas" you can blame your fiendly Federal Government! CHRISTMAS is afterall a federal holiday, and all people of "other faiths" should thank Christians for founding this great country and having the tolerance to give all citizens freedom of religion. Muslims did not come to America seeking freedom from the oppressive tyrannies they were subject to, nor Jewish, nor Budhist, nor atheists. I am not saying that these religions are "evil" or "wrong", but the fact of the matter is this country was founded by Christians who fled the persecution they faced in their homeland. These same people fought, bled, and died to pass the freedoms you now envoke to practice your own religion (or none at all). I do not think anyone should be forced to worship God or observe Christmas as I do --that would be absurd, but I also find the attmept to eliminate God, Jesus, the Trinity, the 10 commandments, Christmas, etc. from our society very troubling. Your co-worker could be more tactful, but he is right -- we do live in a country where the majority of the people are christians. That doesn't mean that those who aren't are less american or anything like that, but the majority should still be able to celebrate their holidays without offending the minority. The minority should be able to observe their holidays too. But it is assinine to come up with some neutral greeting like "Happy Holidays" so as not to offend anyone in the small, but very loud minority. As for Christians being hipocritical -- I think that is the minority tarnishing the reputation of the majority. It think one reason that Christians get so worked up about "Happy Holidays" vs. "Merry Christmas" is that it is the major holiday on our calendar, and when you add it to all of the other attacks on our faith -- it just kind of spills over. The straw that breaks the camels back if you will. I hope this helps. Merry Christmas!
I don't know about muslims or atheists, but even with my shaky knowledge of history I think I can safely say that a good number of jews did come to america to escape tyranny and religious persecution (most notably during WWII, when america knowingly turned away jews attempting to escape nazi death camps, tightening their immigration laws rather then loosening them).
Anyway, I don't think anyone is suggesting that christians not be allowed to celebrate thier holidays, nor is the minority 'offended by the majority celebrating thier holidays.' Everyone should privately be able to celebrate any way they choose. Forbiding you to say 'Merry Christmas' to a fellow christian is not what is under discussion here, no one is against that! But regardless of the fact that there is a larger number of christians in america then other religions, it seems very exclusionary for a greeter to stand in a store and say 'Merry Christmas' to everyone who walks by, not knowing whether or not that person is Christian or Muslim or Jewish or any other religion.
If you know someone is christain, by all means wish them a merry christmas, but what is so bad about wishing someone 'Happy Holidays' in the case that you don't know what thier religion is? Who does that harm? Since when is politeness 'troubling' to our nation?
Lastly I'd like to point out that a multitude of Jews and Muslims and Atheists have died fighting for the freedoms this country enjoys every day as well, and continue to do so at this very moment, which I would like to believe allows them the respect and consideration they deserve and for their voice to be heard.
Interesting fact I read:
...But historians say Protestants were once at the forefront of a battle to ban Christmas. In the 17th and 18th centuries, Puritans, in particular, viewed Christmas as too boisterous or too Catholic, said Leigh Schmidt, a professor of religion at Princeton University.
"It's a historical irony," Schmidt said. "These Puritan descendants are insisting on consecrating something they had a large share in deconsecrating."
Only in the 19th century did Protestants begin to celebrate Christmas again, and even then it was billed as a private family affair, not necessarily a public event, Schmidt said.
Wishes of a few people? I guess you don't know that there are 9,508,770 people in the US (according to 2004 statistics) that do not celebrate Christmas. I'd have to say that 9 and 1/2 million is a little more than "a few people". Granted, there are over 224 million Christians, but who are we, as Christians, to say that the other 9 and 1/2 million people's feelings don't matter? I will continue to say "Merry Christmas" to those that I know do celebrate Christmas, and "Happy Holidays" to those that I don't know. What's wrong with being conscientious of others feelings? Especially during the holidays. We are Christians after all, and are supose to love our neighbors as ourselves.
D.C.
I didn't take the time to read anyone's response after Noam because it's clear they are all wrong. It's FUCKING CHRISTMAS BECAUSE YOU LIVE IN AMERICA YOU IGNORANT BASTARDS. Hello, it's the FEDERAL HOLIDAY. It is what is recognized LEGALY as the holiday, right? Yes it is, in case you are too stupid to know that.
It's Christmas, Christmas, CHRISTMAS. This holiday has NOTHING to do with Christ! I mean the Christmas tree was around long before this imaginary character was created and will be around long after he is treated like an old folk lore or superstition like Zeus or the Unicorn.
I'm not Christian, hell I'm an atheist, but by god (lol) I say Merry Christmas and you should to, yes, even you Christ killing Jews.
Amen.
PS This is Mohammad, I'm just to lazy to log in.
to some people christmas has nothing to do with CHrist- but not to everyone who celebrates it! yes some are lost in the materialism , commercialism of it sure- and there are alot of people who say they are christians just because they live in america but don't have a relationship with Christ either. I think the real scary thing here is how people are trying to take Christ out of everything, i think THAT is the issue, and then we wonder why our country is going to pot, but so we don't " offend " anyone we are taking GOd out of schools, ten commandments out of public places, everything down to how we are greeted at walmart? God surely won't bless a nation that has removed him from everything- and it is a shame that more Christians don't stand up for it- as your co- worker mentioned about the minority voice being louder than the majority. It seems that way sometimes. ANyway all I can say if you remove God from everything, than don't blame GOd when this country goes to pot - as this world seems to be headed quickly. As for me as a Christian I often do the "happy holidays" thing and it doesn't offend me, but i am certainly not going to purposely not talk about GOd, to spare someones feelings, it isn't like the minority doesn't talk about their beliefs, not celebrate their holidays, or try to make their voice heard right? SO i don't think Christians should be quiet about their beliefs either,
I think that this is getting waaaay too out of control. Bracelets that say "Just say Merry Christmas". OK, leave it to the religious freaks I guess. No one is trying to get you insane people to not say Merry Christmas, do you not get that?! This is a debate for what corporations should be saying. Corporations target ALL people, therefore, they cannot just say something to please all of you insanley religious nut jobs. What about the rest of the country? Yes, we know, we know, you think that you are the only ones that matter, well...newsflash...YOURE NOT! Now, if I am in a store, yes, I will say Merry Christmas to people, but, this is not about what we should say during the holidays as induviduals, but what large corporations should say. soooo...a corporation SHOULD say Happy Holidays, it targets EVERYONE. It is stuff like this that makes people think Christians are insane, when you blow things out of proportion and make them into what they're not.
We really live a life of luxury when we can get offended over "Merry Christmas." I had someone say "Happy Kwanza" to me and even though I'm not a black Marxist (read up on the origins and you'll get that) I thanked them for their well-wishes. She meant well and if I don't take it that way, then I'm the one being an asshole.
It seems like tolerance should go both ways. Minorities, like athiests that are 1% of the population compared to 82% that are Christian, are more likely to garner respect and tolerance for their views if they exhibit respect and tolerance for the views of others. If that means gracefully accepting well-wishes that don't line up with your own religious view, despite the odds to the contrary, what does it really cost you and what do you have to gain?
In fact, if you really want to assert your own religion but be a decent person about it, you can say something like, "I'm not a Christian, but thank you for your well-wishes. All the best to you as well." (That's a mouthful in response to a simple greeting, but way better than "You are an asshole.")
I think people, for the most part, are just trying to be nice when they say Happy Christmas, Happy Kwanza, Happy Holidays, Happy Hanukah, Happy New Year or whatever. There is one key word in all of those greetings, "Happy!" Just relax, surround yourself with people you really care about and enjoy the holidays. There are far more important things to get worked up about. Anger about differences in the way people practice religion has caused countless wars and unfathomable bloodshed. I will never understand why people get so angry about the way someone else practices religion. Those greetings shouldn’t hurt you. Now if someone does something real bad like steals your pet, skins it and sacrifices it to their god, then maybe I'd get a little pissed off.
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